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Author
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Topic: CNN,FOX,& MSNBC, Mine Disaster Coverage
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Kelvin Hemholtz
Senior Member
Member # 4288
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posted January 04, 2006 10:23 PM
2:30 -
Let's look at the quote:
quote:
...who said the rescued miners were being examined at the mine shortly before midnight and would soon be taken to nearby hospitals. Mr. Thornton said he did not know details of their medical condition." (That's a lift from the NY Times via Editor & Publisher).
Nowhere does that say they "will be taken to the church to visit with loved ones." Basic street smarts of a reporter who's ever been to any emergency scene would tell one that "taking them to the church" was HIGHLY suspect. I know there was euphoria and time-filling going on at the same time on TV... but that's just not something that would happen. Even if they're fine, for health reasons, insurance reasons, legal reasons, etc... they'd go to the hospital first.
Also, to be REAL picky, nowhere in that quote does the guy say they are alive. But that's me being a rhetorical turd. (Although looking back on that, it could have been an appropriate quote for a guy in his spot. He's not saying either way really.)
The governor WAS quoting what he BELIEVED to be the news from the coal company. However, as he later stated, even HE didn't have confirmation. HIS problem was he didn't SAY he didn't have confirmation. OUR problem as a business was - NEITHER did we. IF all the anchors would have just said "but we don't have confirmation... it's joyous here now and good news, but we still want more official word..." then I think we as a media would have complete cover.
Geraldo running around hugging and kissing people does not give us cover.
You and I just disagree totally that we don't have SOME role in this...in the minds of the PUBLIC. I'm not saying we're TOTALLY to blame, but we are the major conduit of the info through the worlds' info pipeline. We allowed some unfiltered crude info in our pipline and now there is surely some backlash that we have to stand up and acknowledge and strive to avoid next time. That's all I'm saying my friend with whom I disagree about nearly everything on the planet. LOL!
Here's the pisser in my book: we saw real glimpses of Cooper and Hemmer and everyone you can think of as PEOPLE - not anchors - for just a few minutes and it was refreshing as can be. Now I fear that when that situation is CALLED FOR in the future that we're going to see more "robotic" style reporting. Unattached is one thing. Robotic won't win eyes & ears either.
The whole thing is a pisser. A damn shame.
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"I bought an IPod that holds up to 5,000 songs. Or one voice mail from my mother."
Steven Wright
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adam & doctor drew
Open Line Veteran
Member # 6211
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posted January 04, 2006 11:20 PM
quote:
Originally posted by LunchPenalty:
We keep this up and we'll be nothing more than another entertainment channel that everyone rolls their eyes at, if they don't already.
Sorry Lunch, too late.
I do agree with your argument though.
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adam & doctor drew
Open Line Veteran
Member # 6211
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posted January 05, 2006 12:45 AM
here's how one newspaper described what happened.
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Poppy
Member
Member # 9390
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posted January 05, 2006 01:49 AM
I guess what I'm hearing is that if some people here were at the scene and an emotional family member came and told them they'd just been informed the miners were alive -- as church bells rang out in the background and other family members danced, hugged, and cried in the street and church -- they would not put the woman on TV unless and until her story was checked out. They would respond, "OK. Thanks. We'll check it out. See you later, we have to check with the government first."
So I guess it only follows that when, three hours later, another woman approaches Cooper with the startling news that now officials were saying the miners were all dead, that woman shouldn't have been put on TV, either. They should have, again, waited for the government to endorse what the private citzen was trying to tell them -- that the government they rely on so much had already been wrong -- in a very big way -- once.
I was up all night watching, flipping among the cable outlets, and it was great TV, breaking news at its best.
Cooper's reporting was stunning, humble and focused precisely where it should have been: on the people directly involved in the story whose lives would be affected most, rather than on some government official with a thoroughly rehearsed press release or a business owner concentrating on shifting blame to avoid the inevitable lawsuits, justified or not.
By the way Lunch, the media went with the best information available, just as you have repeatedly argued Bush did with his Weapons of Mass Destruction justification for the war with Iraq -- yet you defend Bush when he does it and criticize the media when it does it. What's up with that?
It's plain and simple in my view: You folks that would have pushed the at once-gleeful, next-time devasted, family members aside in favor of government officials and/or company ownership before going with their gut-wrenching, minute-by-minute or hour-by-hour explanations of what they were being told and by whom, oughta get out of TV, now. Surely there'a government job writing press releases with the name -- your name -- "Lap Dog" -- all over it.
[ January 05, 2006, 01:52 AM: Message edited by: Poppy ]
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Bandit '07
Open Line Veteran
Member # 3260
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posted January 05, 2006 02:43 AM
Quick question ... it sounds to me as if the communications center hunkered down and let the party go on for a long time before declaring the "official" word.
Was anyone on the scene trying to get info from the command post - or was the media pretty much locked out of the process?
For the record, I think the media deserves a bit of a pass here. When the guv says it's so, and you have no official word that contradicts it, what do you do?
That said, kudos to the organizations that consistently and accurately attributed the erroneous info to the families.
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2:30
Open Line Veteran
Member # 7186
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posted January 05, 2006 06:55 AM
Kevin-
Actually I don't think we're all that far apart.
quote:
Also, to be REAL picky, nowhere in that quote does the guy say they are alive. But that's me being a rhetorical turd. (Although looking back on that, it could have been an appropriate quote for a guy in his spot. He's not saying either way really.)
You're exactly right. However, when that was added to the information given the families, and the governor's statement, there wasn't any doubt, or anywhere to go for "confirmation."
quote:
IF all the anchors would have just said "but we don't have confirmation... it's joyous here now and good news, but we still want more official word..." then I think we as a media would have complete cover.
Here's where we do disagree: I think it's entirely unrealistic to expect, after the governor's statment, that you'd be looking for more confirmation. No one is going to wait for pictures of live miners before reporting these statements. No one. Not before, not since.
Does that leave us open to someone in a senior government role being wrong? Yes. But we need to be better as a profession about defending our position when they give us bad information.
If the information is properly attributed, that gives us not just cover but justification. That the governor later stated that he made his comments before he had confirmation isn't our fault - it's his.
quote:
You and I just disagree totally that we don't have SOME role in this...in the minds of the PUBLIC.
In the minds of the public I'm sure we DO have a problem...but, as I said above, this is something the industry has to address, one organization at a time. If some organizations screwed up, they get to eat their mistakes. If they did it right and attributed properly, they should explain that, too.
I'm not usually a big fan of blogs, but CBS has Public Eye, which has some interesting comments from people who actually seem to have watched:
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2006/01/04/publiceye/entry1176845.shtml#comments
Also, a good analysis from their in house critic:
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2006/01/04/publiceye/entry1177159.shtml
[ January 05, 2006, 06:57 AM: Message edited by: 2:30 ]
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1-21-09. Regime change!
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Stormin Norman
Open Line Veteran
Member # 1969
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posted January 05, 2006 10:44 AM
I accept most of the defenses you all raise to some degree. But I have two last points to make:
"The night city editor phoned two key news editors shortly after 11 p.m. to tell them that the Associated Press, as well as national TV stations, were reporting that the miners were found alive."
The quote from the newspaper linked above. Like it or not, many members of the media perceived the reporting from the scene as fact. They made decisions based on their faith in its accuracy.
Lastly, it will take time to determine just who talked to whom, but I wonder if the Governor made his statement based on reports he saw? It wouldn't be the first time. For the press, it is important to understand/re-evaluate elected officials and their access to all information. Sure, we can say "if the Governor tells me something then I'm going to go with it." And you're right. But the "government" told us a lot of stuff during Katrina, and they were out of the loop. Local disaster planning in my area leaves elected officials out of certain communications loops. They are briefed once information is confirmed.
If I have an elected official running to a mic during a breaking situation, I am suspect. Maybe that is because I am a cynical a$$hole or maybe its because I know they are seldom in the real loop. They are covering their a$$ or beotching at another level of government.
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Clever Login Name
Open Line Veteran
Member # 6236
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posted January 05, 2006 11:11 AM
quote:
Originally posted by adam & doctor drew:
here's how one newspaper described what happened.
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Fred Thompson has released a comprehensive plan to save Social Security: Kill old hippies.
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New York'rr
Senior Member
Member # 2991
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posted January 05, 2006 11:30 AM
The "Katrina" Media gets it wrong as usual.
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2:30
Open Line Veteran
Member # 7186
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posted January 05, 2006 01:26 PM
New York'rr got it wrong, as always.
The banner on the CNN report is precisely correct.
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1-21-09. Regime change!
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Stormin Norman
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Member # 1969
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posted January 05, 2006 01:28 PM
ok, I'll bite. How so 2:30?
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Tripe Face
Open Line Veteran
Member # 3328
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posted January 05, 2006 01:33 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Stormin Norman:
ok, I'll bite. How so 2:30?
I'm sure 2:30 could say it better, but allow me.
The banner says "Report: 12 Miners Alive" That's true. The was a report (numerous reports actually) from the families, the Governor, the Congresswoman, several media outlets (including Fox, which never bothered to ATTRIBUTE it's statement that 12 miners were alive.
If the banner did NOT begin with "Report:" it would have been wrong. But it did... it told the viewers that this was something that was not set in stone.
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"Tripe is getting far too much attention.
There will be no dealing with him soon." Writer2 11/9/07
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2:30
Open Line Veteran
Member # 7186
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posted January 05, 2006 01:34 PM
Simple: it's properly attributed. The banner says "Report: 12 Miners Alive" - as in, according to a report, 12 Miners are alive. Not "12 Miners are alive" - but, according to a report they are. Yes, the report subsequently proved to be inaccurate...but at the moment that graphic was on the screen, it was correct.
Attribution matters.
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1-21-09. Regime change!
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Stormin Norman
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Member # 1969
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posted January 05, 2006 01:40 PM
Okie Dokey. So if the newspapers that had to beat deadline said "Reports: 12 Miners Alive" they did the right thing?
BTW, I am not arguing the logic, nor the usage. I argue we have a deeper responsibility than that. Especially with human life (or its loss) involved and families waiting for up to the minute word.
Not to mention our own reputations. Gallup poll rates us lower than car salespeople, lawyers, and union leaders is being trustworthy. That would be the bottom.
But dammit Norm, we were first and we were LIVE!
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Tripe Face
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Member # 3328
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posted January 05, 2006 01:47 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Stormin Norman:
Okie Dokey. So if the newspapers that had to beat deadline said "Reports: 12 Miners Alive" they did the right thing?
Yes, exactly!
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"Tripe is getting far too much attention.
There will be no dealing with him soon." Writer2 11/9/07
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Kelvin Hemholtz
Senior Member
Member # 4288
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posted January 05, 2006 02:39 PM
2:30 is right - the caption is fine because it says "report." THAT was a good call by the producer in Atlanta to CG that.
quote:
quote:
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Kelvin wrote: Also, to be REAL picky, nowhere in that quote does the guy say they are alive. But that's me being a rhetorical turd. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2:30 wrote: You're exactly right.
I was happy to read that until I wondered: wait? You mean I'm right I'm being a turd? ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
As to Cooper. I really DON'T have a beef with the guy. I DO question the outright adulation some of you show him. Friends, if you've spent any time at all as an anchor or reporter on a live scene, I would suggest you ALL could have done EXACTLY the same kind of thing given the TIME to do it. Now some of us CAN'T fill the time or ad lib. But MANY people in this business CAN and given the ripe pickings of human emotion and the relative ease of access to people there, he wasn't any better than the woman he kept throwing to... and Hemmer did a great job despite being a mile away up the road. If he was down at the church area he would have provided the same stuff. (Actually his package well BEFORE the breaking events was pretty barfy talking about how hard covering the story was on HIM.)
To sum up: I KNOW a BUNCH of YOU could do it too if you were given the time & tools on the air. Cooper did what you would expect. A nice job.
On access: yes they were close but in my book "not close enough" to the church - for reasons I stated before here or in other threads. Distance only added to confusion in this case. But there was enough leeway for folks to walk about and come TO the media. In that situation, letting people just talk and tell you their story isn't a tough gig.
[ January 05, 2006, 02:41 PM: Message edited by: Kelvin Hemholtz ]
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"I bought an IPod that holds up to 5,000 songs. Or one voice mail from my mother."
Steven Wright
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zeppelin42
Open Line Veteran
Member # 6360
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posted January 08, 2006 08:24 PM
Very simply, the media did blow it. The media have a duty to the public (because of the First Amendment to the Constitution) to report the truth as wholly as possible. In this situation, they reported what they knew to be truth, that only one person had died. While they got that fact wrong, they missed a few more important facts that should have been reported in every one of the 24-hour networks' coverages:
1) The Sago mine had received 273 citiations for MSHA violations in 2005;
2) The Sago mine before the accident had a worker injury rate a little over once a month;
3) MSHA operations have been scaled back under the Bush Administration's charge with a more than 70% reduction in prosecution of violators;
4) MSHA has been put in the hands of people with absolutely no vested interest in mine safety or health, as many of the new staff (under Bush) are former executives within the mining industry;
5) MSHA officials defended themselves from accusations of criminal negligence, saying "...MSHA has also pursued cooperative health and safety partnerships with labor unions...."
In other words, FOX, CNN, and MSNBC all failed to do their self-stated job and "get the facts to the viewers". Why was Geraldo Rivera breaking into a private church when nobody at FOX was looking into the background of International Coal Group (the mine's owner)? Did any of the 24-hour networks even say the words "International Coal Group" in any of their 8-hour-long coverages?
No.
That is why all of them are terrible sources of news who will only eventually make themselves obsolete to our people as news sources, with the sole exception of retired firefighters' widows.
-zep
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